Neo-Geo, Arcade, Portable, & Every Other Platform
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s8n
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Neo Geo a few questions

by s8n Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:39 pm

hi members , i have a few questions.............


1. i read on Neo-Geo.com that if a game says " 100% Authentic " sort of thing when being sold its a boot

i read this in someones signature , im not sure if its a joke or not


2. are reproduction labels on MVS carts frowned upon ?..........if so why


3. ive seen a Youtube video some time ago and in it the guy said that Paypal's policy for boot Carts is that they need to be destroyed and your money will be refunded.


is this still valid in 2014 ?
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by mjmjr25 Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:18 pm

s8n wrote:1. i read on Neo-Geo.com that if a game says " 100% Authentic " sort of thing when being sold its a boot
2. are reproduction labels on MVS carts frowned upon ?..........if so why
3. ive seen a Youtube video some time ago and in it the guy said that Paypal's policy for boot Carts is that they need to be destroyed and your money will be refunded.


1. Likely a joke, do you have a link?
2. By some, but there are enough that don't care that it rarely affects value, maybe $5-10 on mid range stuff ($100 carts). On higher end stuff - Twinkle Star Sprites, SVC Chaos, SSVS, it can affect value by a good percentage (15-20%)
3. Sounds crazy but not sure. It's unlikely a policy as paypal is the payment of choice for many HK shops that specialize literally in knock-off and boot products. It could be a rumor, it could be one paypal employee making a judgement call in a specific case, but I highly doubt it's a policy.

In fact, my mother-in-law once bought a Windows Office disc from ebay, it was a CD-R burn, she filed a case, and ebay/paypal said she needed to mail it back before they would refund. She explained she wasn't comfortable mailing back an illegal disc w/copyrighted material and she was again given the option to return it or have the case closed and no refund. So, if it's a policy, I doubt most employees of either company are aware and they don't often enforce it.
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s8n
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by s8n Sun Mar 30, 2014 8:34 pm

mjmjr25 wrote:
s8n wrote:1. i read on Neo-Geo.com that if a game says " 100% Authentic " sort of thing when being sold its a boot
2. are reproduction labels on MVS carts frowned upon ?..........if so why
3. ive seen a Youtube video some time ago and in it the guy said that Paypal's policy for boot Carts is that they need to be destroyed and your money will be refunded.


1. Likely a joke, do you have a link?
2. By some, but there are enough that don't care that it rarely affects value, maybe $5-10 on mid range stuff ($100 carts). On higher end stuff - Twinkle Star Sprites, SVC Chaos, SSVS, it can affect value by a good percentage (15-20%)
3. Sounds crazy but not sure. It's unlikely a policy as paypal is the payment of choice for many HK shops that specialize literally in knock-off and boot products. It could be a rumor, it could be one paypal employee making a judgement call in a specific case, but I highly doubt it's a policy.

In fact, my mother-in-law once bought a Windows Office disc from ebay, it was a CD-R burn, she filed a case, and ebay/paypal said she needed to mail it back before they would refund. She explained she wasn't comfortable mailing back an illegal disc w/copyrighted material and she was again given the option to return it or have the case closed and no refund. So, if it's a policy, I doubt most employees of either company are aware and they don't often enforce it.





hi mjmjr...............thanks for your reply



na no link , i was reading things on Neo-Geo.com forums and later on it sort of raised an issue in my mind.


i plan to use the below site to verify Carts but the signature got me thinking


http://www.mvs-scans.com/index.php/Main_Page




your mother-in-law situation is interesting , from memory the guy on Youtube said he bought a PS2 Memory Card and had to destroy it and not send it back.

he said if he was to send it back or keep it it can be then re-sold to some unfortunate unsuspecting person.



me im happy to make a Youtube video pouring petrol over a counterfeit item and setting it on fire to get a refund , just dont know if thats accepted and then a refund is given as a policy anymore
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synbiosfan
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by synbiosfan Sat Apr 05, 2014 7:50 pm

1 The 100% authentic is usually a warning sign tbh.

2 Reproduction labels often do indicate a boot since anyone can make them easily. Buying off eBay is risky I'd say 1 out of 10 MVS carts I've bought with repro labels were in fact boots. The carts were relatively cheap but if you're spending the big bucks, you're better off buying from a reputable seller. If you can get the seller to snap quality pictures of the boards most boots are pretty easy to spot. That's also the reason repro labels are needed lol. Some people are careless when opening the carts up. If it's a repro label and the seller won't provide pics, you may want to pass.

3 Yes, NGF's authentication program has exposed a few boots whose owners got their money back through eBay. I got that directly from Dion himself. Not that I had one of the boots.
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s8n
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by s8n Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:40 pm

great info synbiosfan..............



my plan was to buy MVS carts off ebay and then when received check them out myself , it seems like a hassle to get the seller to take photos and send them to me.


but its probably a better choice to get the seller to take photos than get the cart check it out myself and then have something like ebay or Paypal deny me a refund.


im the type of person better safe than sorry
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by synbiosfan Sun Apr 06, 2014 11:37 am

If a boot is well done and priced appropriately, it's not that bad. I was buying 4 MVS carts from a NeoGeo.com member, he mentioned he had a Shock Troopers boot for $25 and I bought it. No issues.

I won a Metal Slug or MS 2 for like $20 shipped of eBay. I noticed sound issues, opened it up & it was a boot.

People knowingly pay hundreds of dollars for Home System/AES bootleg/repro carts of the Metal Slug games so some people don't care.
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mjmjr25
 

Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by mjmjr25 Sun Apr 06, 2014 4:03 pm

Why is 100% authentic a warning sign? The reality is AES and MVS games, particularly high value games, are booted. If a seller doesn't know this and doesn't do something (ie PCB pics) to point out it's authentic - that is MORE of a warning sign.

Regarding "hundreds of dollars" for AES boots. I've not seen any AES conversions sell for over $300, most sell in the $125-200 range. Conversions aren't necessarily boots in that they rarely have issues that boots have - if done "right" (subjective) then it's all original SNK chips taken from an SNK AES donor and an SNK MVS sac.

The cost is generally:
snaplock case - $50
art / manual / label - $25
AES donor - $30-40
MVS original - Varies based on title, $40 for Metal Slug, $200 for TSS

So to buy an MS1 conversion at $160 is pretty much at cost.

I'm not saying I support conversions of officially released games, but I think it's misleading to say people are spending $100's of dollars for boots without giving the whole story. MS1 conversion that plays flawless on original hardware - $160, MS1 original that plays flawless on original hardware - $600. I can see where it makes sense for a lot of people, so long as they don't pass them off as originals - which again, PCB pics can resolve pretty quickly and the onus should be on the buyer as much as the seller to find out and confirm.
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synbiosfan
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by synbiosfan Sun Apr 06, 2014 5:37 pm

mjmjr25 wrote:Why is 100% authentic a warning sign?


It's like when someone says "Rare" on eBay, the person usually knows shit. If you've found it to be true, that's great, really. But I'm still going to warn people based on my experiences :wink:

A couple of AES/Home System bootlegs Of Aero Fighters 3 took forum experts a few months to prove not legit not that long ago.

The Neo Geo games just have a lot of boots out there.

mjmjr25 wrote:Regarding "hundreds of dollars" for AES boots. I've not seen any AES conversions sell for over $300, most sell in the $125-200 range.


Uh, hundreds means more than one hundred, not sure of what you were trying to prove. It sounds like you agree :lol:

I've known people who've bought the boots as real, seller thought they were 100% Authentic!
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mjmjr25
 

Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by mjmjr25 Sun Apr 06, 2014 6:26 pm

You're going to "warn" people that calling a pricey AES/MVS game authentic is a sign that it's a bootleg? ...ok. :roll:

Secondly, anyone who puts out hundreds of dollars without PCB pics is as negligent as the seller.

Lastly, i'm saying a conversion for $150, knowing the chips, sac cart, and snaplock case hold 90% of the value is not spending "hundreds" on a bootleg. The traditional "bootleg" isn't worth much, say an atomiswave cart. It isn't an original shell - it's worthless. The PCB isn't original, it's worthless. The chips aren't original their worthless. Buy an Atomiswave boot for $50 and it dies - it's worth maybe $2-3 for the repro shell.

If someone buys an AES conversion for $150 and for whatever reason the game dies, it holds 50-90% of it's value for the snapcase / sac cart shell / and pcb-chips, if those are salvageable.
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synbiosfan
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Re: Neo Geo a few questions

by synbiosfan Sun Apr 06, 2014 7:15 pm

mjmjr25 wrote:You're going to "warn" people that calling a pricey AES/MVS game authentic is a sign that it's a bootleg? ...ok. :roll:


Do you own any 100% Authentic AES/MVS games? Prove it.

If you're a seller who can't or is unwillling to, I've wasted my time and experts are confused by conversions/bootlegs depending on quality. Most sellers won't/can't/don't know how to so it's a waste of my time. Like I explained above and others at NG.com have noticed (enough that it stood out to s8n, he's not quoting me), like "Rare" it's used by people who don't know shit except adding 100% Authentic means they're going to ask more for it.

Take my opinion as you will.
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