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c0wb0y
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Re: Video Pinball

by c0wb0y Sat Jun 20, 2015 8:01 pm

Ivo wrote:I very often lose a ball through the sidelanes, which is very frustrating. In games like Pokemon Pinball there are often good and acessible ways to activate kickbacks to the sidelanes making it much fairer (which I try to make my priority) but this doesn't seem to be super common.

Maybe I just suck? What gives? Are unfair sidelanes a beloved design element of many tables, or is it a holdover of most pinball tables being partly intended to be unfair like many old arcade games?
Are the really good tables that everyone raves about doing something to address the unfairness of sidelanes?


You don't suck. The game of pinball has been constantly evolving for decades.

You have side outlanes, which traditionally lead to the outhole (end of ball.) I'll agree that older games seem quite difficult with larger gaps between flippers and on some outlanes.
In the mid-sixties the inlane was introduced, which was like an additional opportunity to gain control of the ball to continue scoring. Inlanes deliver the ball in front of the flippers. Gottlieb Paradise was one of the first to incorporate inlanes as we commonly see them.
Some games added gates and the pop-up posts that keep the ball from draining.
Magnets and kickers were introduced in the 70's and early eighties.
The game designers like to play as much as anybody else, and added features like this to let people enjoy the games more. Ball save counters are an extension of this - adding a little fairness for novice players and unlucky bounces.

Inlane and outlane posts can actually be moved on many games. Manufacturers often made little cards indicating liberal and conservative settings. Liberal post settings would have narrower gaps between posts, conservative are wider. Most shipped with posts screwed into conservative settings. The difference is maybe a quarter of an inch. you unscrew a post, move it a little and screw it into the new position.

As for nudging, that's what you do to try and control the ball without achieving a tilt - which is when you apply too much force to the machine. Tilt was introduced to keep people from lifting games physically to cheat for a free game or higher score.
Nudging is a very important part of the game - especially on those older games with wide gaps.
There is a swinging plumb bob in the machine which can be set conservative or liberal. It is up to the machine operator/owner how they want to tune the tilt mechanism.
When the tilt mech is set conservative, it means very little nudge force applied to the machine will cause the swinging bob to bump into the side of the tilt mechanism (a metal ring around the bob.). When the metal points touch - it connects the tilt circuit which means you lose the ball, or even the game on older models.
On very liberal tilt mechanisms, you can nudge harder and still not cause a tilt condition.

If an operator sets a game too liberally and people will win tons of free games - bad for an operator who want to earn money. Configured too conservatively and people walk away because the slightest nudge ends the game earlier than they like. When I play a very conservative machine, I feel like I was cheated out of my quarter. Thankfully most machines I come across are in collections and set to freeplay!

When playing any physical machine, you'll need a few games to get a feel for how tight or loose the tilt mechanism is set. Since the 80's most machines give an audible warning if you're close to a tilt. On older machines - you'll know you pushed too much when the flippers stop moving and you lose your ball or game. :)

Ivo wrote:Another question is tilt. I actually did play a few times on real tables and either I'm puny (which I guess I am) or it is actually really hard to nudge the ball in a real table? Furthermore, most video pinball games are rather limited in that one is not really able to nudge sideways (I believe this is partly related with the sidelanes being even more unfair in some video pinball tables).
Anyone have advice for me?


Some tables are really solid and don't budge much even with a good push. Other tables will seem looser - and "nudge-able." Keep experimenting - you may find that a good nudge in a specific direction just as a ball meets a rubber will help.
I'm with you about the mechanic in video pinball games - it's all over the place. The Pinball Arcade seems to do a good job in last-gen systems. Gottlieb collection on PS2 is one awful exception. Very sensitive tilt on the analog stick.

Keep playing pinball!
Systems: Pong, Odyssey2, Atari 2600, NES, CDX, SNES, N64, Saturn, DC, PS1, PS2, PS3, Xbox, GCN, Wii, Xbox360, OUYA
Handhelds: GB, GBC, GBA, DS lite, DSi, Virtual Boy (<< is that even a portable?)
EM Pinballs: Bally Dixieland, Gottlieb Flying Carpet
SS Pinball: GTB Circus, GTB Count-Down, GTB Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Stern Lectronamo, Stern Galaxy, Bally Black Pyramid
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ExedExes
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Re: Video Pinball

by ExedExes Sat Jun 20, 2015 11:26 pm

Roadshow is out now!

Next month's game looks to be Safecracker, a rather interesting Pat Lawlor concept. It spit out tokens for you to keep or use to play again from the backglass!
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Xeogred wrote:The obvious answer is that it's time for the Dreamcast 2.
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fastbilly1
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Re: Video Pinball

by fastbilly1 Mon Jun 22, 2015 2:34 pm

Safecracker is brilliant. I just hope cabinet support is still in the works. It is the main reason I keep waiting on my build.

And if yall didnt hear, Zaccaria Pinball is getting a PC release, with a table editor.
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emwearz
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Re: Video Pinball

by emwearz Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:00 pm

So the latest update to Pinball Arcade on PS4 unlocks all tables and the Pro updates for the tables (trophy's and everything).

If you have it on PS4 or have a PS4 at all. Worth trying out some of those tables without restrictions, no doubt they will patch it out soon, but why not enjoy from freeplay.
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ExedExes
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Re: Video Pinball

by ExedExes Fri Jul 24, 2015 11:25 pm

Safecracker should be out on most devices today (but not my tablet yet, get with it Amazon) EDIT: It just came now.

The first game to kick off TPA Season 5 next month (just in time for TR, no less!) is going to be The Getaway: High Speed II! About time, it's been a few years since I got to play it for real.

I've also been playing another arcade video pinball game called Time Scanner by Sega. It has multiple screens like Pinball Action by Tecmo.
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Xeogred wrote:The obvious answer is that it's time for the Dreamcast 2.
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fastbilly1
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Re: Video Pinball

by fastbilly1 Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:52 am

Hot Dog! ZZ top action is coming soon.
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ExedExes
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Re: Video Pinball

by ExedExes Tue Jul 28, 2015 11:14 am

It's a great way to kick off Season 5, but it won't be out till near the end of the month. Just a few more days till August. I'm looking forward to this!
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Xeogred wrote:The obvious answer is that it's time for the Dreamcast 2.
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fastbilly1
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Re: Video Pinball

by fastbilly1 Tue Jul 28, 2015 12:06 pm

Even better, Seasons 1 and 2 are on sale right now for half off on Steam and Android/iOS (Xboxen and PS's sale coming soon). That's right, $30 gets you 40 tables (or $40 for Pro Packs). Seasons 1 and 2 include the following tables:
Black Hole
Ripley's Believe It or Not!
Theatre of Magic
The Machine: Bride of Pin•Bot
Medieval Madness
Cirqus Voltaire
FunHouse
Gorgar
Monster Bash
Black Knight
Creature from the Black Lagoon
Harley-Davidson, 3rd Edition
Taxi
Elvira and the Party Monsters
No Good Gofers
Scared Stiff
Big Shot
Twilight Zone
Star Trek: The Next Generation
Attack from Mars
Genie
Dr. Dude & His Excellent Ray
Firepower
Cactus Canyon
Central Park
Space Shuttle
White Water
Centaur
PIN•BOT
The Champion Pub
Whirlwind
Flight 2000
Goin' Nuts
Terminator 2: Judgment Day
Tee'd Off
Haunted House
Victory
Class of 1812
Cue Ball Wizard
El Dorado: City Of Gold

And ofcourse you have Tales of the Arabian Nights. That is alot of gametime for the price of one new game.

Sadly Seasons 3 and 4 are not on sale.
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Kidpanda
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Re: Video Pinball

by Kidpanda Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:09 pm

I wish they would put out Cyclone on PS4 soon. I've been dying to play it and don't want to buy it on PC.
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fastbilly1
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Re: Video Pinball

by fastbilly1 Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:18 pm

Kidpanda wrote:I wish they would put out Cyclone on PS4 soon. I've been dying to play it and don't want to buy it on PC.

Load it up, per Farsight it was supposed to be released on Sunday morning.
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