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Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:56 am
by RCBH928
My new rule with better graphics hardware is if I can't tell which one is better from the screenshot then it does not matter...no need to use CSI camera zooms to find that extra detailed difference.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:53 am
by isiolia
RCBH928 wrote:My new rule with better graphics hardware is if I can't tell which one is better from the screenshot then it does not matter...no need to use CSI camera zooms to find that extra detailed difference.


There'd be a couple big considerations there though.

First would be inherent limitations of your comparison. For instance, a screenshot isn't going to reflect potential differences in framerate/pacing or things like screen tearing. In turn, video comparisons may not accurately show the difference in HDR, resolution, framerate, and so on due to being compressed down into a streaming-friendly size/format.

Kind of the same sort of thing that, say, comparing stills or footage of an emulator or scaler without also looking at latency.


Second would be accounting for what additional power can do for development or design. For instance, real time lighting would have the potential to incorporate visual cues into gameplay, same as surround audio does. The better hardware gets, the more can be done like that versus baked in.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:49 pm
by Ziggy587
I stopped caring about better graphics a long time ago. I'm not sure if I ever really cared.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:21 pm
by PretentiousHipster
I only care about graphics through an artistic sense. On the technical side sure they look cool now, but all we'll get in a few years are them looking outdated. Artistically pleasing graphics are timeless.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:50 pm
by PresidentLeever
I wanted to quote something I liked about the tech side of audiovisual mediums in general, but I don't remember it exactly. To paraphrase: It's not important until you notice something wrong with it. For games that might be stuff like pop-in, an uneven framerate, cracks in the polygons, a voiced line being super low volume, etc. You can also compare something like Wind Waker to Wind Waker HD, where the latter might look "like you remember" the former without a direct comparison.

An ugly or inconsistent art style is immediately noticeable and for me it can be more important in terms of just looking at a game. But since it's an interactive medium, I have to take that into consideration and then it's usually not.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:03 am
by RCBH928
isiolia wrote:
First would be inherent limitations of your comparison. For instance, a screenshot isn't going to reflect potential differences in framerate/pacing or things like screen tearing. In turn, video comparisons may not accurately show the difference in HDR, resolution, framerate, and so on due to being compressed down into a streaming-friendly size/format.

Kind of the same sort of thing that, say, comparing stills or footage of an emulator or scaler without also looking at latency.

Second would be accounting for what additional power can do for development or design. For instance, real time lighting would have the potential to incorporate visual cues into gameplay, same as surround audio does. The better hardware gets, the more can be done like that versus baked in
.


You are not wrong but historically better hardware is associated with better graphics, as in looks better. When it comes to performance I consider frame dropping and screen tearing a flaw in the game and not an issue of the hardware since the other games on the system do not have it.

I would like to see more powerful hardware steered into another direction than better looking graphics. Something like VR, AR, or system AI. Whatever smart and innovative way they can think of. Something more than pushing more polygons on screen I guess.

PretentiousHipster wrote:I only care about graphics through an artistic sense. On the technical side sure they look cool now, but all we'll get in a few years are them looking outdated. Artistically pleasing graphics are timeless.

PresidentLeever wrote:II wanted to quote something I liked about the tech side of audiovisual mediums in general, but I don't remember it exactly. To paraphrase: It's not important until you notice something wrong with it. For games that might be stuff like pop-in, an uneven framerate, cracks in the polygons, a voiced line being super low volume, etc. You can also compare something like Wind Waker to Wind Waker HD, where the latter might look "like you remember" the former without a direct comparison.

An ugly or inconsistent art style is immediately noticeable and for me it can be more important in terms of just looking at a game. But since it's an interactive medium, I have to take that into consideration and then it's usually not


couldn't have said it better. Sonic on Genesis still looks good and better than Die Hard Trilogy on Saturn where Saturn is multiple times more powerful. I am just bothered by the "PS4 vs XboxOne graphics" videos where they use scientific tools to prove which one looks better.

Although to comment on " It's not important until you notice something wrong with it", in videogames we saw graphics that we thought were "life-like" realistic, but after revisiting them a decade later we are shocked at how bad they were. So was there something ever wrong with them? subjective...

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:56 am
by PresidentLeever
Well, as a kid your imagination tends to fill in the gaps. Not to mention the bad cables and smaller screens that made everything harder to make out on consoles.

I was talking about what I mentioned rather than realism though.

I don't remember thinking games were ever that close to reality growing up, we are only getting kind of close in recent years and then it's more like hollywood movies.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:29 pm
by isiolia
RCBH928 wrote:I am just bothered by the "PS4 vs XboxOne graphics" videos where they use scientific tools to prove which one looks better.


If you mean stuff like Digital Foundry does, it's usually done to compare performance, and in turn, how well a particular version plays. Graphics fidelity and features in use are an appropriate part of that comparison though. For as much as the particular game or port can be at fault, a given machine only has so much potential. Games that are pushing the boundaries of what current hardware can support often need to make tradeoffs. It's not even that uncommon now to give the player the option to choose a priority - higher framerate or higher detail.
It's ultimately just comparing ports, as people have done since ever, and if one version plays better it'll probably get the nod over an inconsistent-yet-prettier one. Or, at the very least, the information is available for folks trying to determine which version they'd prefer to buy.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:56 pm
by bmoc
The PS5 showcase was pretty good. I liked the looks of FFXVI and the return to a more traditional fantasy setting. I was pretty disappointed with XV overall so I doubt I will preorder this time. Miles Morales looks great and is probably the best reason to get a PS5 at launch so far. It is nice to know the price and release date finally. $499/$399 for the two editions respectively and Nov 12th street date. No preorder date info though.

Re: Random Gaming Thoughts

Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:04 pm
by isiolia
bmoc wrote: No preorder date info though.


Sony had that signup via PSN ID for preordering. At least for some allocation. So maybe some emails will go out soon.


I liked the looks of FFXVI and the return to a more traditional fantasy setting.


For the single player entries perhaps :lol:

As mentioned on Discord, it looks a lot like a Souls game in combat. Cutscenes had me suspecting XIV expansion at first.

DeS remake looks to be nice too.