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theclaw
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by theclaw Fri Oct 31, 2014 3:53 pm

Ziggy587 wrote:
ApolloBoy wrote:
Ziggy587 wrote:YPbPr offers basically no advantage over S-Video for ~240 video.

Bullshit. The same goes for RGB as well, it beats the snot out of S-video.


RGB and YPbPr are very different, despite many people on the internet claiming they're "equals". If you wanna say RGB beats the snot out of S-Video, I'm not gonna argue at all. But saying that YPbPr has a massive improvement over S-Video with 240 sources, you're really kidding yourself if you believe that.

Again, for DVDs, other 480 resolution sources, and 720p/1080i, yeah, component all day over S-Video. But for 240p like SNES, Genesis, N64, etc... YPbPr has no real visual improvement over S-Video.

People agreeing with me: http://forums.nesdev.com/viewtopic.php?p=124838#p124838


At least in the US, YPbPr is primarily found on lower end displays than RGB.
Compared side by side on a good enough size PVM or similar to notice differences would be fairer.
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Ziggy587
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Ziggy587 Fri Oct 31, 2014 5:37 pm

To clarify what I was saying, I'm not talking in general terms. Just specifically in the case of retro consoles. I know that RGB and YPbPr are comparable, each having their own pros and cons and being more or less equal. But in the terms of the SNES or Genesis, for example, it's a different story. Those consoles are native RGB, and outputting RGB from them to an RGB monitor is always going to be the best bet. But what I was really talking about was S-Video and YPbPr, and again, specifically with retro consoles.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Jagosaurus Tue Nov 04, 2014 1:59 am

Kidpanda wrote:
CRTGAMER wrote:Sega blew it by not incorporating SVideo and offering RGB and Composite only as the choices out of the 8 pin Genesis socket that few NTSC TVs of the day supported.

I anticipate the proposed new 3rd party cable will not just be wires, but have some sort of conversion PCB inline to get the "RGB Sync On Green" to work as regular component 480i. Boxes are already out there that do this, a simple matter of adapting the different cable connections.

As for the kickstarter concept, not a penny from me. Bring the cable to market first. If the product is good and at a reasonable price, only then I will put the money up to buy one.


Back in 1988 I'm pretty sure there were not many TVs that had S-video, or the ones that did were higher end models, couple that with the fact that the Genesis was drawn up most likely in 87 makes it even longer in the tooth. The SNES came out in 91 which TV tech had made some pretty big strides by then.


Exactly. While not directed @ CRT, I think a lot ppl forget how much earlier the Genesis came out compared to the SNES. Later revisions of the Genesis were cost cutting consoles & they weren't going to add features.

I'll see how this pans out before spending money.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Ziggy587 Tue Nov 04, 2014 9:43 am

Jagosaurus wrote:Exactly. While not directed @ CRT, I think a lot ppl forget how much earlier the Genesis came out compared to the SNES. Later revisions of the Genesis were cost cutting consoles & they weren't going to add features.


Especially since no one was using S-Video back then anyway. Most people were just using RF, and some using composite. That's why Nintendo took out S-Video from the SNES mini.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by CRTGAMER Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:19 pm

SVideo came out in 1979. Maybe Sega felt it was not a big enough improvement to justify incorporating into the Genesis and just added RGB. No idea why, SVideo was definitely more common then RGB on US TVs in the 80s. Even looking now at the demise of SVideo, RGB TVs are still uncommon. I find it silly getting an 8 pin Genesis Cable and only having a composite cable to use. Maybe a tease to get a 32x adapter later on. :?

Atari also blew it by offering only RF for the 7800. Even though an older design and a late response to the NES, Composite could have been added and saving a few bucks on production by not including a RF modulater inside.
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CRT vs LCD - Hardware Mods - HDAdvance - Custom Controllers - Game Storage - Wii Gamecube and other Guides:
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Hobie-wan Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:16 pm

Back then as kids most of us had older hand me down TVs if we had our own. The first time I even saw an s-video connector on a TV was on the one my parents bought in 1991. That s-video jack didn't get used until that TV was mine and I bought my PS2 in 2000.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Ziggy587 Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:58 pm

Growing up, I didn't have a TV with S-Video until my parents got one around the time the N64 came out. Also, I only starting using composite over RF around that same time. And that's only because the N64 came with composite cables and no RF connection, so I was forced to. I didn't use S-Video until years later.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by TSTR Tue Nov 04, 2014 9:21 pm

daisy-chained RF switches = classic
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Hazerd
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by Hazerd Tue Nov 04, 2014 10:17 pm

Definitely doing the $35 option for a SNES cable, id get a Genesis one, but my Genesis is the 3rd one.
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Re: Retrovision Making Component Cables for SNES/Genesis

by theclaw Wed Nov 05, 2014 2:48 am

CRTGAMER wrote:SVideo came out in 1979. Maybe Sega felt it was not a big enough improvement to justify incorporating into the Genesis and just added RGB. No idea why, SVideo was definitely more common then RGB on US TVs in the 80s. Even looking now at the demise of SVideo, RGB TVs are still uncommon. I find it silly getting an 8 pin Genesis Cable and only having a composite cable to use. Maybe a tease to get a 32x adapter later on. :?

Atari also blew it by offering only RF for the 7800. Even though an older design and a late response to the NES, Composite could have been added and saving a few bucks on production by not including a RF modulater inside.


I'm not sure. Commodore 64 is known for adding an svideo predecessor, but I thought its modern form was available 1987 or so. Alongside the S-VHS tape format.

That'd seem too soon to justify Genesis including. But raises the question why Sega didn't release an RGB cable in Japan to make up for it.
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