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pierrot
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by pierrot Sun Sep 30, 2018 8:27 pm

alienjesus wrote:I finished up Wario World today. It is a very thoroughly OK game.

The levels were too long, but the game was too short. The game over-relied on it's basic beat-em-up mechanics when it's platforming puzzles were it's strongest point.

Overall, it was decent enough. I wasn't enamoured with it though.

I recall Ex saying about as much about Wario World, too. I guess it's not a must-play, then.


I won't be finishing any more Treasure games before the end of the night, but I spent a bit of time playing Gradius V earlier today. I've finished the arcade version of the original Gradius on one credit before, and pretty much love it. I've also spent a fair amount of time playing Gradius II in the past, but don't quite like it as much. Gradius III I've played a bit, getting good enough to clear the first stage of the arcade version. Gradius IV, and Gaiden I've spent some time with, but feel about as ambivalent about them as I do III. (I haven't played a ton of Rebirth, but it seems really great, from what I have played. Some day I will spend more time with it.) So, I don't know that I necessarily expected a whole lot from Gradius V, even though I've noticed quite a few people talking it up in the past. It does have a fairly strong "Gradius" feel to it; Much stronger than Gradius III or IV. At the same time, it feels a little like Darius Burst, from the graphical style. I don't hate it, but I also don't love the newer 3D model/environment stuff in shooters. I usually don't tend to mind Naomi stuff, though, for whatever reason. So, anyway, Gradius V is pretty easy, up to the second boss. I can't beat it. I hate that thing in Gradius II, and it's way worse in Gradius V. I can no miss up to that point, and still lose all of my continues trying to kill it. I really like the Type 3 ship, which has options set up with two above the VV, and two below, with a distance between them that can be varied with the option button. I don't entirely recall, but I think there might have been a ship type that allows the options to be sort of pinned to certain spots, and short of that, I don't see a way to beat it.

Gradius V does still feel like a Gradius game, but it also feels like a Treasure game. Something about some of the enemy patterns, and a lot about the first boss fight, is very reminiscent of Radiant Silvergun, and Ikaruga. Sure enough, it was Iuchi at the helm again (I had no idea he was involved with Taroumaru). It's always nice to have music by Sakimoto Hitoshi, but it does seem kind of strange in a Gradius game, I have to say. I enjoy it, up to the second boss, but I don't know if I'll really touch it much in the future.
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Exhuminator Sun Sep 30, 2018 9:20 pm

pierrot wrote:I recall Ex saying about as much about Wario World, too. I guess it's not a must-play, then.

This was my review of the game when I beat it in 2016:
Back in the GameCube days, Nintendo was comfortable farming their second tier franchises to trusted third parties for software development. So nobody could blame them for trusting Treasure to handle a Wario game. And thus, in 2003, Treasure gave us Wario World. A 3D platformer starring that loveable scoundrel Wario. The one thing I remember about its release thirteen years ago, was that in 2003 I was able to buy a new copy for less than $20. Wario Ware hit the bargain bins pretty fast.

Now I know why.

On the outside Wario Ware looks decent enough. The graphics are passable (if bland), audio is sufficient (if uninspired), and the controls are tight (though at times ill conceived). At first glance, one could be forgiven for thinking Wario World to be the Wario equivalent of Mario Sunshine. But after spending an hour or two with the game, that lofty assumption quickly evaporates. Where Sunshine was continuously inventive, Wario World is tedious and incredibly formulaic. Where Sunshine was charming and intuitive, Wario World is monotonous and grating. Trading in imagination for sheer tedium, Wario World is a pale shadow of Mario's GameCube adventure.

Wario World only has eight levels. But those levels are extremely long, long enough to be three levels unto themselves. This is actually annoying when you've been playing a level for over thirty minutes, and you'd just like to save your game. You spend your time in these levels repetitively beating up the same old enemies (who get reskinned for each new level), and searching for enough crystals to open the exit gate at the end. The same core gameplay concepts in the first level, are repeated all the way to the end. If you like surprises in your platformers, forget it. Wario World's got one recipe and that's all it's cookin'.

Wario World does have one saving grace; boss fights. We all know that Treasure is the world's best creator of epic boss fights. And even in a game as phoned in as Wario World, Treasure still kept up that aspect of their legacy. Boss fights in this game are truly fun, usually challenging, and always imaginative. The boss fights serve as a stark contrast to the bland nature of the rest of the game. At least here, Wario's beat 'em up moves actually make sense in a game like this. Honestly, I wish Wario World had just been a series of twenty or thirty boss fights. I would have had more fun with that actually.

I could type ten paragraphs explaining in minute detail all the bad game design in Wario World. I'll refrain, but I will complain about the one that bothered me the most. The attack button and dash button SHOULD NOT be the same button. Nothing like attacking on a platform, and then having Wario decide to dash instead and falling off, just because you held the attack button half a second instead of a quarter of a second. That kind of bone headed amateur hour design permeates this entire experience.

Less discerning gamers may find Wario World to be a fun time. Perhaps they could overlook the stuff that continuously bothered me. All I know is when I'm playing a Nintendo published platformer, I expect to have a smile on my face the whole time. With Wario World, I was usually just gritting my teeth and pushing myself to just have the damn thing over with. Yes there are great Wario platformers, I've beaten a few. Nintendo and Treasure have produced some amazing games together as well. But Wario World does not fit either description. Truly every time Wario exclaimed, "Have a rotten day!" I couldn't help but think he was actually talking to me. 5/10

Totally skippable.
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Nemoide
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Nemoide Mon Oct 01, 2018 1:51 am

So it's past midnight, but I finally completed Dynamite Headdy! With the secret/final ending!
This game just oozes creativity and ingenuity, really pushing the Genesis to its limits while going totally nuts in with its design. I really loved it and would say it's a must-play game... THAT DIFFICULTY THO. Like, it's kind of great that the game will sometimes change genres partway through, but it can make the difficulty spike pretty fiercely.

Still, of the Treasure games I've played, this one is currently my favorite! I'm really glad Sega decided to put it on Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection, because I'm sure I'd never have tried it out otherwise! And while I've TRIED it before, I never really sank my teeth into it and appreciated how great it is until this month's TR!
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Eckony Mon Oct 01, 2018 5:36 am

Hopefully still in time, but a couple of weeks ago I've finished Freak Out. The premise of the game is that all twelve of your sisters get possessed by a demon except for you, where the demon by accident possesses your scarf instead. Now it's up to you to save your sisters. The whole game is based on the mechanic that you can control your scarf and grab anything in the level. Once you've grabbed something you can do three things, pull back and release for a snap attack, build up the tension by rotating the analogue stick and release to launch yourself in that direction or press R3 and L3 together to do a scarf bomb where two extra shadow scarfs appear and do multiple snap attacks. Each boss or sister is built around using this mechanic in a different way.

Since your left analogue stick is used for moving and your right to control the scarf, one thing you notice immediately is the camera. Luckily you have an auto-aim in L1, but sometimes not even this make the bosses easier since you have to find some or you have to target something else than the boss itself. Also the first boss is a really bad way to introduce the players to the game, since you're in a really small end enclosed area and the boss is pretty big compared to it, which makes finding the weak point in combination with the camera a real struggle. Another irritation is that you need points to enter a bossfight as well as using the scarf bomb, which you can get in these freeroam levels with regular enemies which is a chore to do and don't really add much to the game.

Overall, the game grew on me once I got familiar with the controls and there are some nice bossfights to be had (especially the 'horror' fight). It's fun and I'd rate it 6.5/10. :)
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PartridgeSenpai
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by PartridgeSenpai Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:35 am

Nemoide wrote:So it's past midnight, but I finally completed Dynamite Headdy! With the secret/final ending!
This game just oozes creativity and ingenuity, really pushing the Genesis to its limits while going totally nuts in with its design. I really loved it and would say it's a must-play game... THAT DIFFICULTY THO. Like, it's kind of great that the game will sometimes change genres partway through, but it can make the difficulty spike pretty fiercely.

Still, of the Treasure games I've played, this one is currently my favorite! I'm really glad Sega decided to put it on Sonic's Ultimate Genesis Collection, because I'm sure I'd never have tried it out otherwise! And while I've TRIED it before, I never really sank my teeth into it and appreciated how great it is until this month's TR!


I'm so glad to see someone else on the site really loves Dynamite Headdy too :D
As for me, it's my favorite Genesis game and it was the reason I held onto my Genesis as long as I did :D
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Exhuminator Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:41 am

Eckony wrote:a couple of weeks ago I've finished Freak Out

In case anybody was like "huh" as I was, this is the European name for what the USA got as Stretch Panic.

Nice job beating the game dude.
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Xeogred Mon Oct 01, 2018 11:14 am

Although I didn't really get around to anything related this month despite wanting to (did dip into some McDonald's Treasure Land Adventure which seems pretty cool), I did enjoy reading a lot of this thread, probably because I'm a huge fan of Ikaruga and that came up a lot. :lol:

I also love Gradius V, but it's the only Gradius I haven't managed to beat yet. Always get stuck on that one stage with the green goo and the panning screen, while the giant structure you're in moves around... with all the goo... and other enemies everywhere. All at once. DEAD!

Hitoshi Sakimoto's score for it and Radiant Silvergun are incredible. :mrgreen:
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by Markies Mon Oct 01, 2018 7:48 pm

Nemoide wrote:So it's past midnight, but I finally completed Dynamite Headdy!


Eckony wrote:Hopefully still in time, but a couple of weeks ago I've finished Freak Out.


Both of those still count!

Nemoide, it was before midnight when you posted that on my end, so I am still counting it. Also, since Eckony beat it a couple of weeks ago, I am counting it as well.

So, our total Treasure Beats this month was 12!

I want to thank everybody that participated in this Month's activities. It wasn't my first choice, but I am glad to have finally beaten Mischief Makers. Also, I'm glad that several other people were able to beat games that have been sitting unbeaten for a long time. We were able to go back and play games that we wouldn't have played otherwise.

And isn't that what Together Retro is all about??
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pierrot
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Re: September Together Retro: Welcome To Treasure Island

by pierrot Tue Oct 02, 2018 2:44 pm

Eckony wrote:Freak Out.

Nice! I'm glad someone played this. I played Stretch Panic (for bonus confusion, the game is called "Hippa Linda" in Japan, which is a nice pun involving 'hipparu'-to tug on-and the titular "Linda") a few years ago, and thought it was pretty cool, if a bit minimalist. Did you get the true ending, or did you just beat the bosses by depleting their health? I didn't really find the game to be quite as satisfying until I beat all the bosses the "correct" way, personally. Some of those later bosses were a real pain to exorcise, though.


Also, I played a little bit of Radiant Silvergun the other day, and I do like it more than Ikaruga, for some reason. Might just be how damn nice it looks, and the incredible Sakimoto soundtrack, though. I think I like having a variety of weapons more than just switching polarities, too, really. It feels a little bit easier to just ignore the puzzle elements in the game. Still way more into stuff like Batsugun, and Espgaluda than any of the Treasure shooters, though.
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