On the subject of 16-bit action-RPGs

[Exhuminator]

Wolf Team's Neugier: Umi to Kaze no Koudou

A few years ago I played Neugier. It started off fairly fun, but about halfway through it seemed to lose focus and got sloppy. So I stopped playing it. I wouldn't say Neugier's bad, but I would say it's mediocre.

Not to beat a dead horse (on your end too? haha), but I really do feel like the Souls series is basically the best thing since 8/16bit ARPG's.

I've finally gotten around to ordering the shelves I need to finish up my new dork cave. Once the room is back in order, and my PS3 is usable again, the very first console game I plan to play is Demon's Souls.

But that's not 16-bit, so I started playing a 16-bit action-RPG last night; Brandish 2. I'd been playing for less than a minute before this happened:



I love it so far.

[Xeogred]

So you just fell in a random trap hole and died?

The legs sticking out... comedy gold.

Nice seeing a minimap.

[BoneSnapDeez]

HAIL FALCOM.

Super Hydlide

You probably know this already, but Super Hydlide is the Genesis port of Hydlide 3. I like the game. Most people don't it seems. It's quite archaic and there are some "equipment weight" and "day/night cycle" mechanics that can be really annoying. The graphics are also ugly as sin. But underneath it all there's a very entertaining and worthwhile ARPG.

And as I'm (likely) the only person on this board who owns the entire series, I'd like to expand on this topic a bit and state that all of these games are worth playing. The first two are pretty rough around the edges and are certainly products of their time (1984 and 1985, so that's before Zelda and Ys) but they're fun and compact little ARPGs. The first game can be knocked off in an afternoon.

Parts three and four feel intentionally brutal and byzantine - similar to The 7th Saga or King's Field - which is something I can certainly respect.

I mean holy shit just look at that.

I've talked about this a bit these last few weeks, but I think I've reached the conclusion recently that I prefer "computer ARPGs" - those that were originally released on systems like the MSX, MSX2, X1, X68000, FM-7, FM Towns, PC-88, PC-98, and so on. (Though there also exists handful of console-exclusives that mimic the gameplay of these computer ARPGs).

In contrast to the more epic console-developed ARPGs like Secret of Mana and Terranigma, these computer games are generally defined by:
- A short, linear main quest and a general lack of sidequests
- Standstill health regeneration
- A low level cap that usually must be reached before game's end
- A small inventory of items, with most being required for the game's completion
- Simplistic combat defined by either the "bump" system or short, stiff sword thrusts
- Save almost anywhere simply by bringing up a menu
- "Mission pack sequels" that are very similar to their predecessors in terms of graphics, sound, and overall design

Examples: (most) Dragon Slayer games, Hydlide series, Ys series, Brandish series, Popful Mail, XZR series, Xak series, Aspic, Courageous Perseus, Golvellius, Kalin no Tsurugi, Sylviana: Ai Ippai no Boukensha, and many many others.

Anecdotally, I find that these games showcase some great music and really interesting art styles (dat late 80s / early 90s anime) and I love the fact that I can breeze right through them.

That said, there's something to be said for something as grandiose as Seiken Densetsu 3. I really do need to get to playing that again.

[Exhuminator]

So you just fell in a random trap hole and died?

That's exactly what happened. If you pay very close attention you can see the traps:

Nice seeing a minimap.

It automatically fills in as you explore, and you can see the whole map when you wish:

[nightrnr]

You probably know this already, but Super Hydlide is the Genesis port of Hydlide 3. I like the game. Most people don't it seems. It's quite archaic and there are some "equipment weight" and "day/night cycle" mechanics that can be really annoying. The graphics are also ugly as sin. But underneath it all there's a very entertaining and worthwhile ARPG.

It was the food management that made me rage. I got pretty far in a dungeon only to starve to death on the way out. I gave up after that.
But that was years ago. I reacquired the game from our buy/sell forums and want another go at it sometime.
I still found the game entertaining, if a little shy of 16-bit glory.

[Sarge]

Food management. Ugh.

[nightrnr]

I'm not even sure that I remember the exact circumstances (or the mechanics in the game). Just that lack of food is the reason I died and that I thought I had prepared well enough for the journey.

It wasn't even amusing, like absurd scenarios in rogue-likes.

[Exhuminator]

Speaking of popful mail, this difficulty restoring patch might be of interest to some people:
http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.p ... 436.0.html

That's awesome, thanks for the link.

[BoneSnapDeez]

"Un-Worked Designs: Working Designs minus bullshit difficulty"



Nice.

I still need the PC Engine CD and Super Famicom ports of Popful Mail. They look rad.

Speaking of Falcom, I've played a bit of the PC Engine CD Brandish, which is rather nice. Some noticeable differences between it and the SNES port. You field of view is much small here, due to all the menus and whatnot.

[Exhuminator]

"Un-Worked Designs: Working Designs minus bullshit difficulty"

Somebody on that forum called them "Wrecking Designs".

Some noticeable differences between it and the SNES port.

The best difference I see there is you actually have the mini-map on screen, a huge boon. The SNES port of Brandish neglects that, because it hates you and everything you stand for.